Article about Basilisk by Alex Spiliotopoulos in The Hatchet
the student newspaper of George Washington University
September 24, 1979
the student newspaper of George Washington University
September 24, 1979
Norman Lederman's Minitron, courtesy of Encyclotronic
The following interview with Norman Lederman, inventor of the Minitron and member of Bazilisk, is excerpted from an article titled "The History and Mystery of The Minitron" on Jack Hurwitz's Encyclotronic site:
Jack Hurwitz:
Basilisk was a group you performed in with the Minitron. How did Basilisk form?
Norman Lederman:
That’s Bazilisk with a “z”. In the mid-1970’s I started to consider how mutually beneficial it would be to join up with like-minded musicians to create original music together. If my memory serves… Bazilisk’s founder, Brett Kerby, placed an ad in a D.C. arts & music newspaper that caught my eye. He was forming the group and auditioning local musicians. We met, I appreciated his classical training and music ideas… and he saw the potential of the Minitron to support his music.
JH:
Who were the members?
NL:
The original seven member lineup included drums, bass and wind instruments, and is vague in my memory today. The final version of the group had Brett on keyboards & vocals, me on Minitron (and borrowed Synthi), Alice Mann lead vocals, and David Meschter on guitar (often highly processed with Robert Fripp-ish layering).
JH:
How many performances did they do? Please share any interesting stories about Bazilisk.
NL:
Most active in the late 70’s, the group performed in a wide range of Washington D.C. area, and Baltimore venues, ranging from d.c. space, to Madams Organ, to All Soul’s Church. I can’t recall the number of performances.
Bazilisk hooked up with a local sound guy, Ace Pace, who seemed to really like what the group was doing. He generously provided a PA system and ran sound for the various live performances… and was paid when money was available.
During this time, the group pitched in to replace Brett’s aging electric keyboard. For some inexplicable reasons… we purchased a large organ (in heavy wooden cabinet) that weighed around 1,000 pounds (it felt like it when we carried it to gigs). Eventually, we removed the organ’s vacuum tube (!) electronics and carried them from gig to gig. Of course, this was not a sustainable idea and I think his keyboard was replaced one more time.
Our rehearsal and recording space was located in the basement of the Physics Department at American University. My professor, mentor and friend, Dr. Romeo Segnan allowed us free and unlimited access during off-hours.
Jack Hurwitz:
Basilisk was a group you performed in with the Minitron. How did Basilisk form?
Norman Lederman:
That’s Bazilisk with a “z”. In the mid-1970’s I started to consider how mutually beneficial it would be to join up with like-minded musicians to create original music together. If my memory serves… Bazilisk’s founder, Brett Kerby, placed an ad in a D.C. arts & music newspaper that caught my eye. He was forming the group and auditioning local musicians. We met, I appreciated his classical training and music ideas… and he saw the potential of the Minitron to support his music.
JH:
Who were the members?
NL:
The original seven member lineup included drums, bass and wind instruments, and is vague in my memory today. The final version of the group had Brett on keyboards & vocals, me on Minitron (and borrowed Synthi), Alice Mann lead vocals, and David Meschter on guitar (often highly processed with Robert Fripp-ish layering).
JH:
How many performances did they do? Please share any interesting stories about Bazilisk.
NL:
Most active in the late 70’s, the group performed in a wide range of Washington D.C. area, and Baltimore venues, ranging from d.c. space, to Madams Organ, to All Soul’s Church. I can’t recall the number of performances.
Bazilisk hooked up with a local sound guy, Ace Pace, who seemed to really like what the group was doing. He generously provided a PA system and ran sound for the various live performances… and was paid when money was available.
During this time, the group pitched in to replace Brett’s aging electric keyboard. For some inexplicable reasons… we purchased a large organ (in heavy wooden cabinet) that weighed around 1,000 pounds (it felt like it when we carried it to gigs). Eventually, we removed the organ’s vacuum tube (!) electronics and carried them from gig to gig. Of course, this was not a sustainable idea and I think his keyboard was replaced one more time.
Our rehearsal and recording space was located in the basement of the Physics Department at American University. My professor, mentor and friend, Dr. Romeo Segnan allowed us free and unlimited access during off-hours.
Leslie:
I remember the sound person that Norman mentioned, Ace Pace. He and an assistant would do the sound/PA systems for the hardcore punk shows. Poor Ace would be running around the stage and in the mosh pit during the whole show trying to save his equipment from the stage divers especially the young ladies who insisted on jumping off the top of the PA stacks into the mosh pit. Also the singers who insisted on diving into the crowd while still holding onto the microphone. Brett and I felt sorry for him as he wasn't making much money and those darnn punkers were busting up all his gear...
I remember the sound person that Norman mentioned, Ace Pace. He and an assistant would do the sound/PA systems for the hardcore punk shows. Poor Ace would be running around the stage and in the mosh pit during the whole show trying to save his equipment from the stage divers especially the young ladies who insisted on jumping off the top of the PA stacks into the mosh pit. Also the singers who insisted on diving into the crowd while still holding onto the microphone. Brett and I felt sorry for him as he wasn't making much money and those darnn punkers were busting up all his gear...
Editor's Note:
The above audio recording of Bazilisk was transcribed from a cassette which Leslie and I have been calling the Early Rarities Tape. Brett Kerby, the founder of Bazilisk, and Leslie's partner with Rob Lippert in Psychodrama, recorded the song directly onto the cassette.
Norman Lederman has identified the songs that are included in the Bazilisk excerpt that Brett gave to Leslie:
1. DIE OUT
2. ANXIOUS
3. WARD C
4. DIE OUT
In her listening notes for Early Rarities Leslie wrote:
"I’m not sure of the song title. That is definitely Norman’s mini-mellotron (Minitron). I also hear Dave Meschter’s guitar (there is some Robert Fripp influence in there.) The male singer is Brett. As I recall the female singer’s name was Alice Mann. She had an operatic voice and was also an Eno fan. She was a very nice, friendly person who rocked a bit of a Sandy Denny look.
"I remember the time that Brett Kerby, Rob Lippert and I went to the 9:30 Club to see Suicide. Alice Mann was there too and really drunk. For some reason, they had one of DC’s less imaginative hardcore punk bands open the show. Most of their fans stayed for Suicide’s set. I guess the 9:30 Club thought it would be funny to re-enact Suicide’s 1977 tour of the U.K. when the punks would gob them constantly during their show. While that didn’t happen in DC, the punks were heckling Suicide non stop. They kept calling Martin Rev “Elton John.” Finally, Alan Vega had enough and challenged the hecklers to come up on stage and sing. Of course none of the punks had the balls to do that. But the next thing we know, Alice has taken Alan up on his challenge and is on stage next to him ready to sing. She was twice as big as Alan and he ever so gently tried to get her off the stage— “That’s okay, baby...”
Alice did leave the stage but she complained the rest of the night about how she wasn’t allowed to sing. And when someone else in the crowd who was there to see Suicide, shouted out a request for “Frankie Teardrop”, Alan received replied “Fuck Frankie!” and refused to do the song.
As I recall, Joan Jett did something similarly when I saw The Runaways. She refused to do “Cherry Bomb” despite the numerous requests. She said something like “We don’t do that song anymore...”. Probably because at this point Cherie Currie was no longer in the band.
I think that back then bands didn’t want to be human jukeboxes and just please the crowd. God bless ‘Em!"
Leslie also mentions on the Early GOF page that Norman Lederman and David Meschter did a show with From Far Away, Beauty?. She shared with me these memories of David:
"I would see David at shows and chat with him. The last show that I saw him at was in 1982 at the Robert Ashley/Laurie Anderson performance in DC. He had just gotten a sound tech gig with John Cage and Merce Cunningham and was moving to NYC.
"Then 20 years later, circa 2001 or 2002, I saw him again. I went on a double-date dinner date with him and his wife. My date and his wife had organized the event but didn't realize that David and I known each other back in our DC days. Much to the chagrin of my date and David's wife, he and I spent the whole time reminiscing about the DC hardcore/progressive rock/noise days and having a really swell time. David said that he had gone to some of the last Madam's Organ shows and had seen the Bad Brains numerous times. David had longish hair, mustache and beard and wore glasses. He had what is now known as the "Brooklyn Hipster" look. But he had it back in 1981 and was still rocking it in the early 00's. He asked me about Brett and wanted to get in touch with him in conjunction with the Basilisk CD project that he and Norman were working on. Unfortunately David and I lost touch and I haven't seen or heard from him since."
The above audio recording of Bazilisk was transcribed from a cassette which Leslie and I have been calling the Early Rarities Tape. Brett Kerby, the founder of Bazilisk, and Leslie's partner with Rob Lippert in Psychodrama, recorded the song directly onto the cassette.
Norman Lederman has identified the songs that are included in the Bazilisk excerpt that Brett gave to Leslie:
1. DIE OUT
2. ANXIOUS
3. WARD C
4. DIE OUT
In her listening notes for Early Rarities Leslie wrote:
"I’m not sure of the song title. That is definitely Norman’s mini-mellotron (Minitron). I also hear Dave Meschter’s guitar (there is some Robert Fripp influence in there.) The male singer is Brett. As I recall the female singer’s name was Alice Mann. She had an operatic voice and was also an Eno fan. She was a very nice, friendly person who rocked a bit of a Sandy Denny look.
"I remember the time that Brett Kerby, Rob Lippert and I went to the 9:30 Club to see Suicide. Alice Mann was there too and really drunk. For some reason, they had one of DC’s less imaginative hardcore punk bands open the show. Most of their fans stayed for Suicide’s set. I guess the 9:30 Club thought it would be funny to re-enact Suicide’s 1977 tour of the U.K. when the punks would gob them constantly during their show. While that didn’t happen in DC, the punks were heckling Suicide non stop. They kept calling Martin Rev “Elton John.” Finally, Alan Vega had enough and challenged the hecklers to come up on stage and sing. Of course none of the punks had the balls to do that. But the next thing we know, Alice has taken Alan up on his challenge and is on stage next to him ready to sing. She was twice as big as Alan and he ever so gently tried to get her off the stage— “That’s okay, baby...”
Alice did leave the stage but she complained the rest of the night about how she wasn’t allowed to sing. And when someone else in the crowd who was there to see Suicide, shouted out a request for “Frankie Teardrop”, Alan received replied “Fuck Frankie!” and refused to do the song.
As I recall, Joan Jett did something similarly when I saw The Runaways. She refused to do “Cherry Bomb” despite the numerous requests. She said something like “We don’t do that song anymore...”. Probably because at this point Cherie Currie was no longer in the band.
I think that back then bands didn’t want to be human jukeboxes and just please the crowd. God bless ‘Em!"
Leslie also mentions on the Early GOF page that Norman Lederman and David Meschter did a show with From Far Away, Beauty?. She shared with me these memories of David:
"I would see David at shows and chat with him. The last show that I saw him at was in 1982 at the Robert Ashley/Laurie Anderson performance in DC. He had just gotten a sound tech gig with John Cage and Merce Cunningham and was moving to NYC.
"Then 20 years later, circa 2001 or 2002, I saw him again. I went on a double-date dinner date with him and his wife. My date and his wife had organized the event but didn't realize that David and I known each other back in our DC days. Much to the chagrin of my date and David's wife, he and I spent the whole time reminiscing about the DC hardcore/progressive rock/noise days and having a really swell time. David said that he had gone to some of the last Madam's Organ shows and had seen the Bad Brains numerous times. David had longish hair, mustache and beard and wore glasses. He had what is now known as the "Brooklyn Hipster" look. But he had it back in 1981 and was still rocking it in the early 00's. He asked me about Brett and wanted to get in touch with him in conjunction with the Basilisk CD project that he and Norman were working on. Unfortunately David and I lost touch and I haven't seen or heard from him since."